Unblocking

Has ANI really come to this? It was supposed to be a noticeboard, meaning, an INCENDENTAL disruption. But 3 options and then a vote? You have to be fucking with me. I have no use for sheep. And sheep are taking 3 options as if they are official.

Now I have no affiliation with either the complainant nor the offender, but a cursory review shows that the outcome is way out of the spectrum of a single complaint. How shitty.

Chip

Well, I suppose it would be nice for those subject to wikipedia's rules to have some certainty around what they are and how they are enforced.

But I think there's a tendency for confusion of process and substance - for me, this stated objective of putting the unpaid labour under extraordinary (humiliating?) conditions so they can "get value out of Vk" is pretty offensive in itself, no matter what page they put it on.

Is wikipedia serving and educating its users, or teaching them to shut up and do as they're told?

I'm starting to think it's a religion, to where, ya, shut up and do as you are told.

There is some evidence of the latter.

Seeing as Alison & Fozzie aren't here & I'm the only other one I'm aware of here who was involved in this case from the start - the "three options" isn't as out of place as it looks. This has been discussed ad nauseam elsewhere (see VK's talkpage, see "The Troubles" at Arbcom, see Giano's talkpage, see BrownHairedGirl's talkpage etc etc etc); the three options are the three possible resolutions most people involved are headed for, and this is a discussion to see if any of the three have major support. It needs to be pointed out that the editor in question has agreed to this.

A condtion involving an abscessed tooth that feels likes your gums are on fire.

Yup, that describes WP and ANI to a "T" …

Jon

In response to Chip asking on ANI why this isn't at RfC...


Huh? It's justified because a vote on an incidents noticeboard where people ask for quick help with real problems can be justified by a successful ending?

Why not just have Jimbo decide the result while blindfolded? After all, "a successful end would justify the means".

So he 'agrees, However...?' That like prefacing something with 'dont take offense, but...' or 'sorry, but...' It's a qualifier. I rarely agree with Awbrey, but as a student of philosophy, I do not believe in this teleological ideal that the ends justify the means. There are channels for this. To see the sheeple voting on an outcome at ANI is bullshit.

My disgust was why I quit. My disdain is why I stick around.

What would you have suggested? Lots of people watch ANI, is I presume why they chose to do it there. Better than on Jimbo's talk page



?

I would implore that a witch hunt, including diffs and incidents is not fit for ANI. ANI is not for community consensus, but for administrators dealing with a situation. This should be at RfC.

And I quit WP out of disgust. However, my disdain for the dealings keep me charged because if I quit, I lose my voice. I want to keep my voice.

Good thing too.


Lots of people watch Jimbo's talk page, doesn't that equally justify it (it doesn't, I know, that's the point!). We actually have an RfC process which, amazingly enough, is designed for this sort of thing. That's probably why some people don't use it for this sort of thing - God forbid there's a chance the drama could be resolved because, as a first step, the best venue is being used.8

This topic appears to belong in the Bureaucracy Forum.

Just my sense of it …

Jon

You are correct. Mea culpa, Jon. I'll get the hang of this place, eventually.

Speaking of moving the thread, could we have a HAGGER??? forum set up just for lulz?

Hagger? I Googled and I Wiktionaried, but I don't know what that means. I fear though that its not a good thing.

The infamous Grawp vandal.

"Diiiiiiiiiisgusting!"

Done

This time it's the opposite of a witch hunt (which perhaps makes a refreshing change), VK is getting unblocked, not blocked. AN/I is a place where anyone can comment and give their opinion on what action should be taken, for which I am very glad. I'm glad it's on this page, not sneaked away in an archive or subpage which no-one except selected admins know about and they can hold even more of a kangaroo court.



Ah, I get you. If you had that much disdain, I don't think you would bother going on WP though. I think you will get lured back into participating in a degree of accord with the other admins. Your comment above, for instance, could be read as indicating you think admins' opinions on how to act can be divorced from the opinion of the rank and file. Not about this particular case, but your comment that AN/I is for administrators dealing with a situation and not about consensus, when in fact it is something in between- we all can give our ideas and opinions as to whether a situation needs administrative action and what action should be taken.

You will perhaps deny this, but my 'theory of mind' about you is that you think administrators are above the other members and you know they have more power than we flunkeys. In that case, you will think the slightly more prestigious (and so less worthy of your disdain) position on wiki is that of an admin, so you will eventually return to it in full force.

Anyway, I thought you left more because you were outed/were afraid of being outed by Brandt, rather than any disgust at wikipedia?

I took a cursory review of what was happening at ANI. It became a vote. As far as I have used the WP:DRAMA page, it was for handling events, not summary judgment.

Do I really think, that as an admin, I am more prestigious? In all honesty, it allows me to get away with shit that most cannot. I can create a stub, without it being deleted. I can blow off steam without being seen as a trouble maker, given that my 10k or so edits were somewhat positive. I will not argue with you on that fact. Like I have mentioned several times, I have been witness to many mediations led by my Father, but given his clout as a law enforcement official, people treat him differently. That is simply a fact of life. But it amounts to whether or not I should request I have the tools taken away, in order to have an equal voice. We all know that it wouldn't work. Admins gets voices, and new users fight to gain one. I make no bones about that, nor agree with it - but it is how things work.

As far as Brandt goes, look at my original posting. I was certainly not happy about being placed in a corner. However, my real name is already on my userpage, along with my real friends. Brandt does not fear me, nor do I fear him, and it is probably some mutual respect, given my position on BLP, although I do not speak on his behalf. He most certainly can out me. And he most likely knows that I can most certainly out him. However, I have no interest in Brandt.

I made it quite clear why I left, and find your bringing my fear of outing to be somewhat of a diversion. You're the 'whistle,' not me. I make no bones about enjoying the fact that I can share with both websites, but I also have not portrayed myself as a whistleblower. If Brandt wants to out me, he is going to do it regardless. But you certainly have to realize that your clout here is diminished in the same way that KStreet has come about things. You want to leak? Fine. You want to be anonymous? I'm all for that. But you have to know, that at the end of the day, as my Dad would say, a prison rat is only good for so long. It's a position that I certainly do not envy.

Are you considering bearing witness to some corruption, injustice, or cover-up within the system?