You can't make this stuff up!



Sheez, can't they do anything right?

Here's Andrew's blogpost with Erik's comment: it's number 4....It's pretty rude, if you ask me.

"I'm sorry you had such a rough time" just isn't in the Wikipediot vocabulary. Except when a fellow Wikipediot is being "wiki-stalked" or "wiki-harrassed" online, of course. Then the passionate songs of support and admiration come pouring forth on User_Talk pages!

A perfectly deserved slapdown, I'd say. That post was American tourist-ing at its infuriating worst. The man's an ass: what does he expect, bloody commuter rail linking the airport and his hotel? Sheesh. Moeller's been remarkably restrained.

One would have expected that, when they made the choice of the location, that issues such as "transportation" would have been part of that decision...and obviously, they weren't.

That said, Erik is the one who gets a salary from WMF. Ever hear of "the customer is always right?"

Dude, be real. Andrew lives a good part of the time in China and spends his fair share of time in rural China where the conditions are not much different than what you'd expect in Egypt (although at least there he speaks the language).

Andrew's post was a "Wow, what a crappy day I've had", not "Wow, Egypt is fucked", with a bit of "Obviously I should have planned ahead a bit more on this one". His only complaint in that whole post was directed at Accor for charging him nearly $30 for 24 hours of internet access. Moeller's condescending and lecturing response indicates that Erik is terribly terribly touchy about Alexandria being chosen as the location for this year's Wikimania, and is preemptively defensive about any commentary regarding that. And in typical Erik fashion, he defends by attacking.

I guess this thread is probably going to touch on Wikimedia's city selection for the Wikimania. I hope the Foundation members weren't motivated in their decision by, "Wow, I've never been there before and it would be great to go there especially since my travel will be paid by someone else!"

They need to choose cities that most of the majority of Wikipedians, which I assume mainly come from Europe, the US, Canada, Japan, and Australia, can get to with some flexibility in scheduling and not too much "planes, trains, and automobiles." I'm not sure if Alexandria meets that criteria. Cities like London, Paris, Berlin, New York, Sydney, Singapore, Tokyo, and Los Angeles, do meet this criteria.

Hooray for Owen Thomas, who wrote the Valleywag piece. He made a solid connection between Erik's unhelpful reply and Wikipedian culture. That is better than taking sides between Lih and Moeller.

What unhelpful reply? The man whined about conditions in a third-world country, and Moeller pointed out he didn't read the damn manual. This is no different from how most people with travel experience would reply, and stretching it to talk about WP culture is a little absurd.



Kelly, there are no similarities whatsoever between China's infrastructure development and Egypt's, something immediately obvious to anyone who buys a $7.99 guidebook.

msharma, welcome to Wikipedia Review, Jimbo.

...you may be a Wikipedian. RTFM is a mainstay of unhelpful internet culture. We will just go ahead and mark you down for Moeller.

Well, we know Wikimania 2009 is already slated for Buenos Aires, Argentina. Jimbo probably caught sight of one of my favorite Argentines and immediately rigged the selection.


That being said, we still have 2010 open for discussion, and I would like to nominate one of the following conveniently-accessed locations:

• Ascension Island in the Atlantic Ocean. Scheduled traffic is Royal Air Force to/from the Falkland Islands, usually operated by an RAF Tristar, or maybe we could subsidize Air Luxor to resume operations.
  
• Amundsen-Scott station in Antarctica. Only accessible part of the year by ski-equipped USAF C-130s.
  
• Papeete, Tahiti. The strategic gateway to the South Pacific, Air Tahiti Nui operates from the International Terminal Building.
  
• Iqaluit, Nunavut, Canada. Very convenient access via scheduled passenger service from Ottawa, Montreal, Rankin Inlet, and Kuujjuaq on carriers such as First Air and Canadian North.
  
• Maybe a seaside village such as Pevek would be quaint.
  
• Eareckson Air Station, Aleutian Islands. The only scheduled flight is a FedEx DC10/MD11 to bring supplies once every 2-3 months. What could be easier transportation to Wikimania than shipping yourself inside a big FexEx box?

If Argentina is a big hit in 2009, why not go right next-door in 2010 to Chile? Mataveri International Airport has regular service.

I can see both points of view. But I think the blog post is understandable. He's venting, big deal. The choice of location for this Wikimania was completely stupid. If I could afford to go, when seeing it was in the middle east, I would have said a quick "Fuck that," for pretty much the same reasons Greg and Gomi pointed out. It just doesn't seem safe considering female rights, the views on homosexuality, and the fact that we (the U.S.) are warring in that part of the world. Top that with the images of Muhammad, and I seriously would just rather stay home.

Stupid idea, inconsiderate to the vast majority of supporters (both in donations and volunteer work), female, homosexual and especially Jewish editors. Canada 2010!

They probably chose Egypt to represent the multicultural, global aspect of the Wikimedia Foundation's mission.

http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate

That video there is so ironic once you actually start to know stuff about how Wikipedia is run. And so ripe for parody and being satirised.

Jimbo clearly thinks he's a God as far as the Internet and the flow of free information go in today's world. Indeed, anything to do with Jimbo Wales or Wikipedia's public image generally makes me laugh, but it also makes me worried that people will uncritically take the bullshit he has to say at face value, like that thing in the Guardian a few weeks back.

http://wikipediareview.com/index.php?showtopic=18819

I can understand the desire to showcase the "global" aspect of Wikimedia by having a conference somewhere like Alexandria or Buenos Aires I guess. But two years in a row?

Perhaps they are sending a signal by holding their conference at the site of a notable library that later burned down, taking its entire body of knowledge with it?

And I think it was burned down by someone named Julius Kosher ... or was it Ceasar?

Oh, very good! Can't match that metaphor.

But it also had that great lighthouse that was one of the Seven Ancient Wonders, but is no more.

Look on my works, ye mighty, and despair!

So which am I, Jimbo......



....or Erik?


By the way, if you ever go to a third world country, RTFM. That's the real world, not the internet.

Andrew Lih makes a complete idiot of himself here.

Tourism is Egyptian bread and butter. People knock themselves out trying to be your personal travel guide "I will do it all for you" and they do it all for you.

If that's not fine for you, and if (like me) you want a bit of privacy, you rent a car for 50 bucks a day and drive on super-cheap gas. He could have driven to Alex and dropped off the car at the Alex Avis station, probably without a drop-off fee, for 50 bucks (but you have to be an defensive-and-aggressive driver, which I am ). He shouldn't be such a cheapskate. But since he is, he should have gone to the bus station. Someone would have helped him get on a bus. Buses are pretty modern, safe and air-conditioned there. But you never take the train. Only really poor people do that. If he asked anyone they would have told him, and helped him buy the tickets.

He was probably approached by about 20 people offering to help him and he thought they were scammers. That's how you are a tourist there, you use the free-lancers. Or you have a pre-arranged thing before you arrive.

Global internet roaming costs are a nightmare anywhere outside the USA and Asia. Even country-to-country in Europe is outrageous. They just got some sharing system set up a few years ago, but it is still really bad. It used-to even be bad *in* the country. I've made so many mistakes, and have paid thousands in-country and while travelling. But that's the breaks.

Why didn't he just take the 80 dollar (400 LE) cab ride there? He's a fuss budget.

Whining about the airport? Airport unfriendly? That's funny. I've been in that airport a ton of times, and you know how unfriendly it is? The people in the greeting hall remember me, and say "how are you?". I have no idea who they are. Baggage handling guys. They aren't bs-ing. One of them told me what kind of dress I was wearing the last time I was there, and it was one year ago. That's unfriendly? No.

He keeps pointing out how people don't speak English. Huh??? *Most* of the people in the airport area speak English, and what was he doing lugging his luggage across the street anyways. Is he nuts?

What's the matter with him? Anyone can get cranky while travelling, but you don't write about it and blame the country.

Conclusion:

Disillusioned Lackey is hotter mama than Andrew Lih. "Friendly" and "flirting" sort of go hand in hand.

Greg..... that's so unfair. I'm sure that Andrew would get lots of friendly comments on his wearing apparel, if he smiled, and was cheerful.
(Though frankly, blondes do get a bit of preference there. Maybe he could try a wig? )

Jon

I for one completely agree with Andrew's analysis. I mean, I wasn't expecting Egypt to be brilliant. But in all honesty, it was the worst country I've ever been to. I only went because I wanted to go to Wikimania, and may not be able to go again. I was very disappointed with the lack of organisation to help attendees actually get to Alexandria.